Mending Balance

What do you think about mending? (Select up to 4)


  • Total voters
    37

Zemoj

Code Wizard
Staff Member
Documancer
Apr 2, 2019
92
32
18
Something we've talked about behind the scenes is the balance of mending, so what do the players think?
 

Wazler

New member
Feb 12, 2020
10
0
1
Also love how even the voting choices are biased on what the staff wants
EDIT: crossed out original comment to do updated poll wording

EDIT: also if we were only to have enchanters be able to enchant mending: make sure ONLY the villagers that are librarians cant be interacted with
 
Last edited:

727021

New member
Documancer
Oct 7, 2019
16
3
3
23
Rexburg, ID, USA
727021.github.io
One problem I’ve had with not having mending is how expensive diamond blacksmith repairs are. It’s hard to level up my repair skill without doing diamond repairs, and at my current repair level, I use way too many diamonds to repair my gear. I want to be able to focus on building my town and leveling jobs, not grinding for diamonds and repairs. If mending is limited (it should probably be limited in some way), I’d like for it to not be completely nerfed. I don’t enjoy having to worry about breaking the bank to get my tools fixed all the time.
 

MagicMerchant

Member
Oct 12, 2019
64
21
8
I believe mending by itself is in a good spot but repair from blacksmith is way too underwhelming.
Perhaps these two can meet in the middle if something has to be done? Mending needing more exp to repair an item (thinking maybe 20-30% at most) and repair being made cheaper so you dont need 10-20 diamonds for one item (I know it scales with GoS level but most will never reach 1000+ where prices are okay).

Doing a complete mechanical change like limiting to durability sounds bad imo and will cause confusion and probably scare away people.

Though all in all my first thought seeing this is that your goal is to make the game less fun.
What are your goals and thoughts about this?

Is the goal to force dependency on someone else to repair your items? At what point do people just logout if they can't find a high level blacksmith fast enough or not having enough to sustain their playing themselves? Because running an unbreaking 3 tool down to 0 durability takes less than ten minutes. Are we supposed to be finding and messaging blacksmiths every 5-10 minutes? And do these people want their chat and gameplay interrupted all the time?
And what about off hours, like when I play there is often <5 people online. Do I logout or spend a stack of diamonds per hour to play if none with smithing 800+ is online and willing to help me?

Currently it costs over 10 diamonds to repair an item for people with low smithing (mine is around 400 and an axe can take 10 diamonds to repair). It's just too expensive and reward is quite low. Removing mending won't make repairing items as BS desirable. It will be making sure people think twice about doing things ingame.


Im personally fine with mending being made so enchanters only can add it. Perhaps on level 50 and a higher price than current enchants. But imo it has to stay and working mechanically like it does now (tweaking numbers so we need more exp is fine to some degree). It has to be resonable for new players to get it without spending months of playing. Even if the source might be buying enchanted tools from others or books from fishing, chests etc.

Im finding it hard to select options to vote. So will clarify. I believe this isn't a problem so im voting for 1.
The other 3 votes is to show my thoughts if you have to do changes.
 
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Zemoj

Code Wizard
Staff Member
Documancer
Apr 2, 2019
92
32
18
Though all in all my first thought seeing this is that your goal is to make the game less fun.
What are your goals and thoughts about this?
Man remember just like a few updates ago when vanilla anvil repairs would just stop letting you repair at all and you had to just make a new tool, those days sucked. I think we can find balance between then and now with using the same tools forever at no cost ( except the xp people arent using much of anyway ).
 

rainbowcraft2

Member
Documancer
Sep 26, 2019
57
21
8
Something we've talked about behind the scenes is the balance of mending, so what do the players think?
I think it should restore 2 -> 1 durability per exp and be relatively uncommon again. You could add mending II and make it really rare and make it restore 2 durability per exp. It would be pretty cool as a tome.

Alternatively just make it as-is a tome and make it the cheapest tome, using 3 mending pages and a single leather to make the mending book.
 

Wazler

New member
Feb 12, 2020
10
0
1
Man remember just like a few updates ago when vanilla anvil repairs would just stop letting you repair at all and you had to just make a new tool, those days sucked. I think we can find balance between then and now with using the same tools forever at no cost ( except the xp people arent using much of anyway ).
yeah but this is a server with towny that requires you to mine endless hours just to get some flawless diamonds to build more safely so you need that good tool to last you forever otherwise people will get burnt out much quicker
 

Wazler

New member
Feb 12, 2020
10
0
1
I think it should restore 2 -> 1 durability per exp and be relatively uncommon again. You could add mending II and make it really rare and make it restore 2 durability per exp. It would be pretty cool as a tome.

Alternatively just make it as-is a tome and make it the cheapest tome, using 3 mending pages and a single leather to make the mending book.
wouldnt makeing it enchanter T6 be enough, but we still have to consider those who like the other villager types to use
 

Strunkandy

Former Wiki Enthusiast/Staff Lead
Documancer
Sep 9, 2019
97
17
8
19
Just going to throw my two cents in, and before somebody says anything, I hadn't read that trading was being disabled again until this morning when I woke up, and I have no bias towards anyone but my own beliefs on the subject.

Also love how even the voting choices are biased on what the staff wants
I'm going to be honest, like I said before I still stand with having no bias, this isn't what we're looking for when we post something like this. If you can't be constructive please don't post anything at all. I really don't care if you crossed it out or whatever you decide to do, it's simply unneeded.

I want to point out that blacksmiths already have the ability to make unbreaking books as well as mending books. In all honestly mending and unbreaking books should be disabled entirely from trades considering there's an alternative and it's more challenging than trading a stack of potatoes to a villager.

Mending being added to enchanter I won't entirely disagree on, but making it a T6 enchant and making sure the cost is expensive and equivalent to that of blacksmiths ability would be ideal.

A tome is another possibility, but I honestly think my idea of removing mending from villagers and replacing it with job abilities would make it a bit more challenging (and simple) overall. As I said I really don't think trading a few crops for emeralds, then a few emeralds for mending books, is very balanced.
 

MagicMerchant

Member
Oct 12, 2019
64
21
8
Man remember just like a few updates ago when vanilla anvil repairs would just stop letting you repair at all and you had to just make a new tool, those days sucked. I think we can find balance between then and now with using the same tools forever at no cost ( except the xp people arent using much of anyway ).
Yeah I played those days. On this server just six months ago. It was hell until we got mending and ways to gain exp going.

The cost is our time. Our most valuable resource. We dont have infinite of it. Effort+time==fun should return true (1).

You can increase the time needed (make it so mending need more exp to repair). If its not enough try sweetening the deal on the blacksmith side so they meet at a better place. Because then the blacksmith route can be the easy way out if you have money to spend on diamonds (time you invest doing other things can be used to repair).

And this I haven't tried, but if exp buckets can be used to repair perhaps remove them from the game or block that somehow. Using furnaces to repair is also gone. So then the only instant option is to use blacksmiths (assuming you can find one).
Rest costs time. And in many cases quite a bit actually.

I believe tools should be permanent and useable without too much hassle. Even more so with 1.16 coming where it will be much harder to get top tier items. Getting eff6 netherite stuff wont be that easy. A new casual player probably needs 100-200 hours of playtime for one item? So it can take them months to reach this. Just one item finally done!

Mending being at lvl50 enchanter can be the way perhaps? Like needing perhaps 30k exp to put it on an item? The game will be less fun from my perspective but perhaps this increases fun for others?
 
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Zabyne

New member
Oct 7, 2019
12
8
3
Ole Appalachia
Mending has been OP from its release, and continues to be OP to this day.

My suggestion however, for incorporating it into more stable usage, would be the following.

Make it rare again. Disable it from villagers but leave other enchants possible to acquire.

Lower Repair Costs 'some'. I sell tons of haste 2 potions regardless of the existence of Eff 6 tomes. Because until such time that people have acquired the income to get eff 6, haste 2 is a great midline for instabreaking stone. At its current state, Smithing Repair isnt as equal of a midline. (I would suggest first off, not tying repair costs to the amount of diamonds used to craft an item. Armor repairs are WAY WAY overpriced because of this. While shovel repairs are too cheap imho.) Maybe something like 12 diamonds for a full repair at low GOS level vs 6 diamonds to repair at high GOS level. This would encourage the sell of diamonds in the long run too, for those who dislike mining but prefer other ways of playing besides mining for hours on end. "Innocent Whistle"

Leave Mending tied to Blacksmith job ability. Maybe consider a different recipe that doesn't use P.Diamond but is near equal in rarity. (Enable legendary monster essence drops and tie it to that maybe, maybe 2-4x Legendary Mob essences per book, would encourage the use of wild monster hunting, pull ppl away from spawner's a bit) Seeing as P.Diamonds already suffer a HUGE demand problem.

As for Enchanter. Disable keepXP. Not gonna be a popular opinion, but if you wanna stop the xp flood something has to give. XP is too easy to get when it never goes away. It just simply accumulates over time. This will get worse when the mending fix occurs next update. (In case its not known, Mending is gonna get smart and not waste xp on already repaired items, but will scan items and repair lower durability and when everything is full durability will then go to the player, if i understand the patch notes correctly)
 

SkydiverPony

New member
Dec 8, 2019
10
3
3
I feel there are two types of players,
1) The players that will enjoy the grind to finish off the job caps at 50, I even heard someone say remove the cap.
2) The type of players that enjoy Minecraft Towny. The ones that enjoy to build, design get material for the town and player shops.

With that in mind, it was said before
One problem I’ve had with not having mending is how expensive diamond blacksmith repairs are. It’s hard to level up my repair skill without doing diamond repairs, and at my current repair level, I use way too many diamonds to repair my gear. I want to be able to focus on building my town and leveling jobs, not grinding for diamonds and repairs
I enjoy Minecraft to relax after a day of work, Now if I have to go and mine a stack of diamonds to repair my pick because of the blacksmith repair issue will cost so many diamonds to level or repair I wont have time to build. Even digging for diamonds you wont find enough xp to mend your pick fully. So Still need time at a mob grinder to repair a pick.
If I wanted to spend this much time to train blacksmith / repair, I would still be playing Runescape for months of grinding a skill.

I recall the day I logged into Horizon after I noticed it was back online from my last OMM. I was glad to see it was back, I wanted to get right back into building, got some cash made, I found a player shop. Bought some diamonds for tools, some basic enchanting books, maybe fortune 3, unbreaking 3, like 1k each. Then saw sign. Something like "These are the last mending books, when they gone, they gone, 40K" found Villager trading was off was the reason for high cost.

If Mending is only available to high level enchanting or blacksmith what will the price be for a new player to get added to a tool, then you also have to ask around and find one online? What are Tomes right now 80k-240k adding Mending as a Tome is not the answer.
I feel that Villager trading is vanilla, it should stay as is. Everyone has access to getting a villager trader up on day one if they wanted as part of their build, or player shop. Its part of MInecraft. So I don't see the balance issue.

Is the goal to force dependency on someone else to repair your items? At what point do people just logout if they can't find a high level blacksmith fast enough or not having enough to sustain their playing themselves? Because running an unbreaking 3 tool down to 0 durability takes less than ten minutes. Are we supposed to be finding and messaging blacksmiths every 5-10 minutes? And do these people want their chat and gameplay interrupted all the time?
And what about off hours, like when I play there is often <5 people online. Do I logout or spend a stack of diamonds per hour to play if none with smithing 800+ is online and willing to help me?
I have done this very thing, I was unable to repair my tools, so I stored them in chests and waited for blacksmiths to be able to repair. Other times I logged out because I switched jobs only to find I didn't have a pick to use.
 

Sally_nightmare

Member
Documancer
Nov 30, 2019
26
7
8
In my opinion I think mending should be a rarity. I think it should be disabled from villagers but leave the other books alone.

Having blacksmith being able to craft mending and having mending as a tier 6 enchant to me should be enough for having mending accessible but not in high excess. However, I taking away mending and making it rare again does mean other balances need to occur.

I agree with the opinion that blacksmith repairs are a little too high and that it can be difficult to find players with a high enough GoS to make repairing worth while. The way the economy is right now it's almost better to just enchant a new tool instead of repairing in some cases.

My answer. Disable mending for villagers but leave the rest, make it a tier 6 enchant and craft-able by blacksmith only, and lower repair cost for blacksmith.
 

MagicMerchant

Member
Oct 12, 2019
64
21
8
As for Enchanter. Disable keepXP. Not gonna be a popular opinion, but if you wanna stop the xp flood something has to give. XP is too easy to get when it never goes away. It just simply accumulates over time. This will get worse when the mending fix occurs next update. (In case its not known, Mending is gonna get smart and not waste xp on already repaired items, but will scan items and repair lower durability and when everything is full durability will then go to the player, if i understand the patch notes correctly)
Keep exp is disabled at high ranks according to staff. They have said so multiple times.
But yea could be a way to remove some exp.

Yes in 1.16 mending on armours will be a thing. Not like now where it eats up a huge chunk of the exp gained. Overall this is quite a small impact on the game though with armours lasting near forever anyway. At least for me it takes few weeks to get armour durability low enough to worry about repairing it and I have never put mending on a piece.
 

Wazler

New member
Feb 12, 2020
10
0
1
I feel there are two types of players,
1) The players that will enjoy the grind to finish off the job caps at 50, I even heard someone say remove the cap.
2) The type of players that enjoy Minecraft Towny. The ones that enjoy to build, design get material for the town and player shops.

With that in mind, it was said before


I enjoy Minecraft to relax after a day of work, Now if I have to go and mine a stack of diamonds to repair my pick because of the blacksmith repair issue will cost so many diamonds to level or repair I wont have time to build. Even digging for diamonds you wont find enough xp to mend your pick fully. So Still need time at a mob grinder to repair a pick.
If I wanted to spend this much time to train blacksmith / repair, I would still be playing Runescape for months of grinding a skill.

I recall the day I logged into Horizon after I noticed it was back online from my last OMM. I was glad to see it was back, I wanted to get right back into building, got some cash made, I found a player shop. Bought some diamonds for tools, some basic enchanting books, maybe fortune 3, unbreaking 3, like 1k each. Then saw sign. Something like "These are the last mending books, when they gone, they gone, 40K" found Villager trading was off was the reason for high cost.

If Mending is only available to high level enchanting or blacksmith what will the price be for a new player to get added to a tool, then you also have to ask around and find one online? What are Tomes right now 80k-240k adding Mending as a Tome is not the answer.
I feel that Villager trading is vanilla, it should stay as is. Everyone has access to getting a villager trader up on day one if they wanted as part of their build, or player shop. Its part of MInecraft. So I don't see the balance issue.



I have done this very thing, I was unable to repair my tools, so I stored them in chests and waited for blacksmiths to be able to repair. Other times I logged out because I switched jobs only to find I didn't have a pick to use.
DON'T make this a job of a game, DON'T take away vanilla MC because you cant/don't want to configure your GOS to be enjoyable fun and not a chore to lvl up
 

Wazler

New member
Feb 12, 2020
10
0
1
Yeah I played those days. On this server just six months ago. It was hell until we got mending and ways to gain exp going.

The cost is our time. Our most valuable resource. We dont have infinite of it. Effort+time==fun should return true (1).

You can increase the time needed (make it so mending need more exp to repair). If its not enough try sweetening the deal on the blacksmith side so they meet at a better place. Because then the blacksmith route can be the easy way out if you have money to spend on diamonds (time you invest doing other things can be used to repair).

And this I haven't tried, but if exp buckets can be used to repair perhaps remove them from the game or block that somehow. Using furnaces to repair is also gone. So then the only instant option is to use blacksmiths (assuming you can find one).
Rest costs time. And in many cases quite a bit actually.

I believe tools should be permanent and useable without too much hassle. Even more so with 1.16 coming where it will be much harder to get top tier items. Getting eff6 netherite stuff wont be that easy. A new casual player probably needs 100-200 hours of playtime for one item? So it can take them months to reach this. Just one item finally done!

Mending being at lvl50 enchanter can be the way perhaps? Like needing perhaps 30k exp to put it on an item? The game will be less fun from my perspective but perhaps this increases fun for others?
And throwing this out there anyone reading if enchanter can ENCHANT mending after the dust settle i will do it for FREE like i did back on MaM just supply the xp ;)
 

rainbowcraft2

Member
Documancer
Sep 26, 2019
57
21
8
wouldnt makeing it enchanter T6 be enough, but we still have to consider those who like the other villager types to use
I like villager trading when it's enabled. If mending is too OP I'd rather mending be weaker, maybe with a stronger version available.

If it can just be removed entirely from villagers that would work too. I still like the idea of making it a tome though. Maybe all mending trades could be replaced with mending book page trades, essentially making the book 1/X times less common. Like if mending needed 4 pages it would mean the villager trade is 4 times as expensive and are lot more sensitive to supply and demand with those items.
yeah but this is a server with towny that requires you to mine endless hours just to get some flawless diamonds to build more safely so you need that good tool to last you forever otherwise people will get burnt out much quicker
I mean, there is unbreaking 4 and it's a lot easier to max out a tool's enchantments so you won't need to replace it very often. Even if mending restore half as much durability it would still be able to easily last forever with unbreaking 4.
 
Dec 25, 2019
23
6
8
I think it is a complete balancing problem.
1. The cooldown of jobs. On the old server i was able to switch to blacksmith to do some repairs, or switch to enchanter to enchant items.
- Here i have to wait 6 hours to switch again. Most people just logout to skip the cooldown.

2. The amount of durability that is restored with repair, is just a joke. I have a chest full of axes, shovels and picks, just to repair stuff at the anvil.
- I don´t want to stand in front of a spawner with tools in my offhand, just to repair them. I want to repair them with 1-2 diamonds, like before.

3. The GoS Skills. With Mcmmo i got arrows back, had a higher crit chance, got "hammer" with my axe, had a good repair, had double smelting, got a lot of stuff by digging sand, gravel, aso.
- Now GoS is just feeling useless. The new treecutter is a bit OP, but everything else is not working, or just useless.

4. The tomes. You are getting those mainly from voting. You also can get them from heroic mobs. But there is no information, where and from wich mobs i can get them. The prices are only for people with a lot of money.
- On the old server u where able to get them from the casino, too. Or you invested some of your voting points. (You could get 10 each day !!)

5. The long time run. I want to get the jobs to high level and want to run a shop for all people. Where u can buy stuff u don´t like to farm.
- At the moment it is hard to keep the shop filled. Many people like the prices, but it is hard work to keep it filled. With MCmmo and Villagers u are able to keep up and fill this shop. But not at the moment.

6. Villagers are hard to get. Not like before with the merchant job.
- You will not get xp or money with trading. You will change crops, or rotten flesh, aso. into something usefull. It is hard work to craft diamond eggs , find zombie villagers, heal them, find some usefull books, or other stuff and then get emeralds. And there is no use than trading for emeralds ...
So, as long as there is no easier way, to get villagers, or a option for emeralds, i don´t see a problem with trading, at the moment.

7. A lot of jobs, recipes and such are broken, or gone.
- There are jobs u have a lot of work and you will not get something out of it. (Chef job, like crafting a lot of ingredients and then only have some food)
I know, that there is a lot of work left, but if u can take the faq, aso. from the old system, why u can´t take the old server shop, the casino, or such stuff from the old backups !?
Tea is still a recipe, but u are not able to get it. U can´t craft alcohol. Traps are not working. Most people just have their private spawners, until i tried to break with it, anvil recipes and jobitems are too expensive, or just decoration. Monster essence, impure and potent items .. there is no information, where i can use them and some of them are just useless.


Its not just because villager tradcing is turned off. It is because so many things are wrong and unbalanced at the moment :(
I can make the list much longer and could write all day long. But as most of you know, i´m from germany and my english is not the best.
 
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Wazler

New member
Feb 12, 2020
10
0
1
Just going to throw my two cents in, and before somebody says anything, I hadn't read that trading was being disabled again until this morning when I woke up, and I have no bias towards anyone but my own beliefs on the subject.


I'm going to be honest, like I said before I still stand with having no bias, this isn't what we're looking for when we post something like this. If you can't be constructive please don't post anything at all. I really don't care if you crossed it out or whatever you decide to do, it's simply unneeded.

I want to point out that blacksmiths already have the ability to make unbreaking books as well as mending books. In all honestly mending and unbreaking books should be disabled entirely from trades considering there's an alternative and it's more challenging than trading a stack of potatoes to a villager.

Mending being added to enchanter I won't entirely disagree on, but making it a T6 enchant and making sure the cost is expensive and equivalent to that of blacksmiths ability would be ideal.

A tome is another possibility, but I honestly think my idea of removing mending from villagers and replacing it with job abilities would make it a bit more challenging (and simple) overall. As I said I really don't think trading a few crops for emeralds, then a few emeralds for mending books, is very balanced.
this comment was directed at the staff memeber or memebers that made the poll, once the wording was changed i striked it